I won't deny that Conservatives can be obnoxious, but I couldn't help but think of a handful of local Libs when read this "advice" column entry over at Slate.com. Advice on manners and morals. - - Slate Magazine. The (Liberal, Slate regular reading) advice-seeker wrote:
Hi Prudence,You need to read what "Prudence" wrote in response . . .
I'm an office manager at a very small company, where I work with three other girls. In short, I am much smarter than my co-workers. When one of them asks a dumb question (i.e., "What's so bad about Fox News?"), I try to be sensitive and explain without making them feel stupid. Sometimes, though, I get very frustrated, and it's difficult to hold my tongue. Yesterday, my co-worker's sister came in to visit and announced shamelessly that she had never heard of Craigslist. After she left, I exclaimed to my other co-workers, "I can't believe she's never heard of Craigslist!" My co-workers defended her, saying they had never heard of Craigslist until they moved to New York City. I find this preposterous. I didn't say anything else because I didn't want to come off as a snob (which is probably how I'm coming off in this e-mail; my apologies). How does one handle working with people like this? I could keep my mouth shut and go with the flow, but it makes me feel dumb when I don't speak up—I feel that if I don't acknowledge their stupidity, then I'm not doing my duty as an informed young woman.
—Dumbed Down
20 comments:
We can all be jerks sometimes, especially me. As Ivy pointed out, it's "part of the human condition."
When one's full real name is attached to one's posts and comments (for any Googler and present and future employer to find), it puts a dent in bad behavior and trash talk, don't you think?
I support some anonymous/pseudonymous bloggers, such as Drinkin' the Franklin Kool Aid -- I have no problem with the anonymity at all, because I understand the purpose and the need and the desire for anonymity sometimes. And I'm fine with Six Meat Buffet. I wouldn't put my name on that either. Just. Kidding. Guys. We do have to live and protect our conventional lives, and the pseudonymity somehow adds to the entertainment value of the things one does find funny. (I'll have to analyze that sometime. :) )
But for some bloggers and commenters, anonymity is just a way and an excuse to insult and bully and run wild to no good purpose, without accountability or repercussion. Things get out of hand pretty fast.
As I mentioned to a few bloggers recently, the blogosphere is rumored to be a self-policing place, but often I don't see that at all. If all the nice and semi-nice people give up and leave in disgust, then what's left?
You're one of the nicer folks around, Ned, and I respect what you have to say and I'm interested in what you have to say even when we don't agree.
Thanks for the kind words, Donna, and ditto.
Ned,
When the editor of MCB, Katherine Coble, invited a known bully, liar, stalker and all around evil person like #9 to blog, then MCB will get what they deserve.
Kat invited him to blog knowing he had terrorized me which led to me leaving blogging in early 2006.
To say I was sent into shock when she did that would be an understatement. I assure you, I've never been anything but kind to Mrs. Coble, and she turned on me like Judas. Again.
In addition to, she gave me her word that she would not tolerate that high school crap and clique crap that went on with WKRN. She promised, as did two others.
Then she invited #9.
Ivy or John has got to stand up for what is right...what they promised, and get rid of #9. He intimidates and bullies--and I can't stress enough Katherine Coble knew that when she invited him to be part of MCB. And, the kicker is, he lives in East TN and has nothing to do with Music City.
I gave MCB my full support, and emailed others to support them when they started, and so many people emailed me and warned me not to trust Kat again...after the way she had dissed me in the past, but stupid me, I gave her a second chance. Heck, I even forgave #9 (of course he didn't ask for forgiveness, but I forgave, anyway) and he went after me again.
There are plenty of community blogs that don't have this problem.
Katherine Coble invited it and until she admits she was wrong and apologizes for her mistake and corrects it, MCG will continue to go down hill.
Unfortunately, I have never known Mrs. Coble to apologize for her mistakes and make any effort to correct (via action) the harm she does.
There are plenty of good people there, but to knowingly invite evil is almost unforgivable.
Ned,
Keep up the good work, and keep bloggin'! I have just found your blog via MCB (granted, I'm not from the "Music City"). Your posts are thought-provoking and engaging, and I enjoy them.
Can I add you to my blogroll? I'm trying to get my new blog up and runnin'.
Sharon,
I'm sorry to hear about that history, and I hope that everything can be reconciled. I trust you know that you are not one of the "Local Libs" I was referencing in the post.
Eric,
Thanks for visiting, and I only allow people to list me in their blogroll if they list me in their blogroll. Good luck with your blog.
When the editor of MCB, Katherine Coble, invited a known bully, liar, stalker and all around evil person like #9 to blog,
Ivy personally invited #9. I did not.
Ivy also invited Sharon...months before Ivy extended an invitation to #9. Sharon declined.
Ivy or John has got to stand up for what is right...what they promised, and get rid of #9. He intimidates and bullies--and I can't stress enough Katherine Coble knew that when she invited him to be part of MCB.
Again, I did not extend the invitation.
Ivy did.
The email where Sharon accused #9 of raping her, though, sent up red flags to all of us.
A portion of that email:
Damn you....how dare you bring me into this drama. How dare you./..after me raped me online. HOW ***** DARE YOU
It was me that invited #9 to be a contributing author at MCB. I talked to him in an email and was convinced that he would tone his normal shtick down at MCB. And I think so far he's doing okay.
I had no idea of Sharon's history with him. Either it happened before my time or else it happened during a time that I wasn't really paying attention.
At any rate, I apologize, Sharon, that we added someone you've had such a history with, but so far I don't see any problems with #9's posting and I won't remove him unless he does something that would warrant the removal.
I had no idea of Sharon's history with him. Either it happened before my time or else it happened during a time that I wasn't really paying attention.
Sharon, I can vouch for this on Ivy's part, and also want to say that I knew nothing of your history with #9, either. I've only been blogging for a little over a year, and, thankfully, I still don't know all of the negative history that some folks have.
I hate when things like this happen, because so many of us regard you as such a great writer and blogger...and at the same token, have only had good experiences with #9, even though we don't agree on everything politically.
This is such a difficult thing. I wish everybody could just get along. It sucks and it truly breaks my heart.
I know the MCB have so many single liberal non-Christian males over there they wouldn't possibly need a similar perspective from me, let alone Sharon. What they need more of are people like #9, Blue Collar Muse and you Ned.
Gosh, this sounds like a dating confidential, though I'm not sure that folks are looking for a certain profile; I think it is more along the lines of the issues raised in this post . . . but maybe I'm wrong.
Some people are forgiving, whether the offender has apologized or not. I believe Sharon tends to be that way. I am not, especially when there has been no apology. So I sometimes have to struggle to see things from the perspective of people who can find it in their heart to be so forgiving and let bygones be bygones. I would just smack 'em and move on. Most times you're better off, I think.
I don't know all the history, but enough. I'll just inject a couple of thoughts here. It bothers me -- a lot -- when bloggers post private e-mails they have received (I've seen a couple of the female bloggers do that, more than once). It is petty, wrong, and the full context is missing, meaning the poster can make it look any way she wants it appear. And in the instances I'm thinking of, the posters were not without taint or fault.
It also bothered me -- a lot --when I saw #9 and Katherine Coble (on the Says Uncle blog, I believe) accuse, practically state as fact, that Sharon had gotten #9 kicked off the NIT blog -- without supplying any evidence for such a charge.
Supporting political blogging is very important to me, though I am not as invested in this blog "community" as the actual bloggers are -- I view the blogs as one means to a particular end, related to my own political purposes; y'all do the work and I hop on and hop off (thanks!). I think it is in everyone's interest to leave junior high school behavior to the actual adolescents.
Basic respect is all most people ask or hope for in these discussions and exchanges.
Donna,
I hear you, but don't you agree that sometimes it is impossible to offer support for a charge without posting an email you've received from someone?
Ned, trust is a funny thing. Once broken, it can never be repaired to its original condition. This is a case-by-case thing, and we have to consider the public good and the things at stake in some instances, but I would never want people to think they couldn't send me something in confidence, and when I see people publicize private communication, I know that is not a trustworthy person.
Yet, if you've already been attacked and it's relevant, then all's fair. But don't be deceptive by leaving out the context that indicts your own self.
You're right about context and the case-by-case nature of it all. Isn't conflict fun? Regardless, I agree that it is wise to be intentional in how we interact with and respond to others.
Sorry to be a party to the hijacking of your blog here, but, Donna, I sure wish you had a blog. You are one of the most interesting folks out there.
I know we disagree on a number of issues, but thatis unimportant.
On another point, a number of us (hell, probably tons of us) have been undergoing some fairly serious problems - medical, personal, etc. To read the words 'rape' in a discussion about internet blogging makes me so sad. Using a word like this in comparison to what the word truly means is not only offensive, but it lessens the true meaning of the word.
I've not had much time to blog or even think about blogging lately, because I'm one of those people who are undergoing what seems like a truck-load of problems, but I have vowed, whenever I am around, to delete any comment or post (at least the offending part of the post or comment) on MCB that smacks of personal insult. If the 'odddigit' or anyone else is personally insulting, the comment needs to be excised.
Bloggers will NOT be dis-invited from MCB until they repeatedly show they can't follow the rules or until Ivy decides they need to go (it's really her blog).
And finally, Ned..I know you love to fire the shots over the bow at us libs, but if you think that letter you cited (and the wonderful response you linked) apply more to one segment of the population more than another (e.g. conservatives/liberals/libertarians/whigs), then you need to get out more. Snobbery and elitism seem to exist on every level and in every environment.
thanks.
John,
Thanks for stopping by.
Re. Donna--I've told her the same thing about starting a blog.
Re. the pot calling the kettle black, I agree and even stated that in the post. But my swipe was particular for recent discussions at MCB where commenters or post-ers operate with a tremendous blind spot (or with flawed premises), not about "what truth is" but about the character and education and integrity of those with whom they disagree. What some folks seem eager to foster is less like "community" and more like "community theatre" with one's ideologically-sympatico peanut gallery as the audience. But thanks again for your kindness to me (generally) and your work with MCB (always).
Ned - love your line re 'community theater' vs 'community. I may have to steal, er, borrow that one sometime.
I think of you as a blogging friend..that's why I feel it's my duty to give you occasional crap.
Ditto.
E ya later.
How do you rape someone online? Email them pictures of your junk?
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